Talk:Never Say Die!

Clarity of this sentence

"Some songs were written with Walker but, after deciding not to leave the band, Osbourne refused to do any of the songs and rewrote several of them" This sentence should be edited somehow to say that Osbourne did indeed rejoin, but keep the overall structure of the sentence intact. Probably something along the lines of "Some songs were written with Walker but, after deciding not to leave the band, Osbourne rejoined the band. Osbourne refused to sing any of the songs written with Walker, and rewrote several of them" (nsigend comment by 216.209.183.119)

• Please sign your comments and get an account. So... rewrite the sentence. Major revisions to articles should be discussed beforehand, but changes like that needn't be. Edit boldly!--Hraefen ^Talk 17:29, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

This album is connected

• All song titles serve as redirects to this album or have been placed at the appropriate disambiguation pages.--Hraefen ^Talk 17:51, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

Air Dance

Why does "Air Dance" redirect to this page? J04n (talk) 11:02, 22 December 2008 (UTC) Mathlaura 18:51, 29 March 2007 (UTC)

all 4 sing on hard road?

i just got this album and listened to it, and it sounds like just ozzy on a hard road, but it does sound like the others on swining the chain..... maybe it was a typo? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.96.42.18 (talk) 22:56, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

Multiple Issue Box should be removed

Unless anyone disagrees I will remove the "multiple issue" box from this page. J04n (talk) 11:03, 22 December 2008 (UTC)

Changes to Dave Walker text

I changed the Dave Walker text from where it said "former Savoy Brown & Fleetwood Mac vocalist Dave Walker" to read "former Savoy Brown and future Fleetwood Mac vocalist Dave Walker" because at the time he was with Black Sabbath, he had not yet sung for Fleetwood Mac. Having it written the way it was was misleading, making one believe he was a former singer of Fleetwood Mac before he was with Black Sabbath. BucsWeb (talk) 14:17, 22 April 2009 (UTC)

Track listing?

In the Black Box, which is a CD release of the original albums, the track listing for this album is as follows:

1. 'Never Say Die'
2. 'A Hard Road'
3. 'Junior's Eyes'
4. 'Shock Wave'
5. 'Johnny Blade'
6. 'Air Dance'
7. 'Breakout'
8. 'Swinging the Chain'
9. 'Over to You'

which means there are multiple transpositions of tracks. However, the disc itself seems to follow the track listing of the original album (via track lengths). Is there any sourcing on a packaging error? MSJapan (talk) 05:42, 15 July 2010 (UTC)

Orphaned references in Never Say Die!

I check pages listed in Category:Pages with incorrect ref formatting to try to fix reference errors. One of the things I do is look for content for orphaned references in wikilinked articles. I have found content for some of Never Say Die!'s orphans, the problem is that I found more than one version. I can't determine which (if any) is correct for this article, so I am asking for a sentient editor to look it over and copy the correct ref content into this article.

Reference named "MusicMight":

• From Black Sabbath: Sharpe-Young, Garry. "MusicMight.com Black Sabbath Biography". MusicMight.com.
• From Ozzy Osbourne: Sharpe-Young, Garry. "MusicMight.com Black Sabbath Biography". MusicMight.com.

Reference named "AMG Biography":

• From The Devil You Know (Heaven & Hell album): Monger, James Christopher. "AMG Biography". Allmusic. Retrieved 2009-03-08.
• From Ozzy Osbourne: Ruhlmann, William. "AMG Biography". Allmusic. Retrieved 14 February 2008.
• From Black Sabbath (album): Ruhlmann, William, AMG Biography, Allmusic, retrieved 2008-02-14
• From Warner Bros. Records: Ruhlmann, William. "AMG Biography". Allmusic. Retrieved 2008-02-14.

I apologize if any of the above are effectively identical; I am just a simple computer program, so I can't determine whether minor differences are significant or not. AnomieBOT⚡ 14:30, 4 November 2012 (UTC)

Hard Road

On the single and original copies of the album, this track was called "Hard Road". Somewhere along the line it became "A Hard Road". Might be worth mentioning. Bretonbanquet (talk) 23:54, 23 July 2014 (UTC)

It turns out that both variants of the title existed since the very first releases of LP in 1978, "Hard Road" being from those of Vertigo (UK and Europe) and "A Hard Road" from Warner's (US). So that both may be considered original. The same applies to CD reissues since 1980s. (Yet on the well known 1996 remaster from Castle [ESM CD 329, a UK release] both variants are present at the same time: "A Hard Road" on its sleeve and "Hard Road" inside the booklet). I agree that this uncertainty should be clarified somehow. Maybe the difference between Vertigo's and Warner's original releases is exactly what needs to be mentioned? — Mike Novikoff (talk) 18:15, 8 November 2016 (UTC)

I knew someone would reply eventually! Haha... I think that's a good idea - some kind of explanatory note to clarify that by the sounds of it, both titles were original and therefore "official". That should stop people changing it from one to the other all the time. Bretonbanquet (talk) 19:52, 8 November 2016 (UTC)

Genres

I figured I'd start a discussion on this because there's been a bit of conflict. One editor removed a couple of unsourced genres, a second then responded by claiming that no genres should be assigned to this album on the basis of a former Metal Maniacs editor referring to it as "diverse, unbalanced and eclectic". Anyway, if anyone has any thoughts on the subject they can share them here. In the meantime I restored heavy metal as the genre, which I feel is appropriate. Caper454 (talk) 22:12, 19 February 2015 (UTC)

If it's diverse and broad, then the most appropriate genre is simply "rock", as that is a broad term. For the songs that are heavy metal, I also put heavy metal in there. I feel that's a pretty appropriate categorization. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2602:306:8B83:4860:58D:190C:D4F2:3950 (talk) 04:11, 20 June 2015 (UTC)

An album's genre is not a collection of the various song genres, it is taken from what published sources say about the album as a whole. Nobody calls this a rock album, or a heavy metal album. Binksternet (talk) 06:09, 20 June 2015 (UTC)

It is indeed heavy metal. Some fucking idiot keeps labeling it as "hard rock". If they label this as hard rock, then Iron Maiden might as well be labeled as hard rock. TheEarthboundFan2001 (talk) 03:46, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

I apologize for my use of foul language, I sometimes have fanboy moments. But I just think it's irrational to just label them as "hard rock". TheEarthboundFan2001 (talk) 04:34, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Hard rock?

Why do you guys keep changing it to hard rock? Black Sabbath is a heavy metal band! All albums include heavy metal songs in them. Most of the songs are heavy metal! Please stop changing it. TheEarthboundFan2001 (talk) 03:49, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Rock band?!

On other pages regard Black Sabbath's other albums, the band is referred to as a heavy metal band. On this page they are referred to simply as a rock band. Please keep the wikipages consistent, things like this really bugs me.

Thanks

Fipler Metalus Fipler Metalus (talk) 15:56, 19 July 2017 (UTC)

@Fipler Metalus: They are consistent. Sabbath is a rock band, some of their albums are heavy metal, in other words, it is completely conceivable for a punk band to have a heavy metal album. It is because of this concept that your request here will not be done. - FlightTime (open channel) 16:03, 19 July 2017 (UTC)

@FlightTime: Sabbath is actually regarded as a heavy metal band since a majority of their content is heavy metal. I was not saying that everything they released was metal. This album certainly is not but Black Sabbath's main genre is heavy metal.

Thanks

Fipler Metalus

A consensus in the past determined that in the opening sentence we use rock band, while in the infobox we list the genre (heavy metal or any other). – Sabbatino (talk) 16:17, 19 July 2017 (UTC)

"Over to You" listed at Redirects for discussion

An editor has asked for a discussion to address the redirect Over to You. Please participate in the redirect discussion if you wish to do so. Bsherr (talk) 18:03, 14 April 2020 (UTC)

Jazz fusion as genre

Never Say Die! album is heavily based on Jazzy sound. I've been trying to add this genre to wiki but admin always delete this with verified sources. HoodsCZ (talk) 00:30, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

@HoodsCZ: What is your supporting reliable source? - FlightTime (open channel) 00:34, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

HoodsCZ (talk) 00:43, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

References

Well the first reference does not even mention Jazz fusion Checking second one. - FlightTime (open channel) 00:49, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

And nether does the second. - FlightTime (open channel) 00:51, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

Guess what? - FlightTime (open channel) 00:52, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

Maybe you should know what jazz fusion means. Jazz Fusion (also known as Jazz Rock) is a style of music that combines elements of jazz with rock. HoodsCZ (talk) 01:02, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

I don't need to know if a reference doesn't mention it. - FlightTime (open channel) 01:03, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

The sources only say jazz so should I add Jazz as genre to the Heavy metal band and this album? That's nonsense. HoodsCZ (talk) 01:12, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

No, you should open a discussion and seek consensus first, see what other page watchers think. - FlightTime (open channel) 01:14, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

When we find a consensus you delete it anyway because the links don't directly say jazz fusion. HoodsCZ (talk) 01:31, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

If consensus is reached in your favor, no one can delete it. - FlightTime (open channel) 01:33, 17 March 2024 (UTC)